Why Austrlaia Strict for Asian English Standards - Page 2

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Why Austrlaia Strict for Asian English Standards - Page 2


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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 04-27-2010, 04:02 PM
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dr aqeel

Hi,i am from pakistan can you plz send me ur email i have some ielts help links i will send to you
kind regards


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Old 04-27-2010, 05:18 PM
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It doesn't matter why. It won't change, so just accept it and apply yourself.


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Old 05-27-2010, 03:49 AM
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For many years, i have tried to make sense out of the english requirement for migration purposes. I came to the conclusion that the whole system does not make sense. Under the current system , your skills are less important than your language proficiency given that more points are allocated toward your ielts test score than your university degree. In the end of the day, no matter what your ielts score is, if you don't have the proper skills to become a doctor, then, the system is inefficient. it does not take a genious to figure that out. the emphasis should be on one's skills not on a perceived " language proficiency"

i have taken the ielts test twice socring an overall score of 8 with a minimum score of 6.5 in the writing section. yet, i was awarded 15 points, the same point awarded to people with a score of 5. make sense? The method used to assess one's proficiency in english fail to account the subjectivity of the test. ielts is not a math test. Yet, they persist in maintaining this requierement of 7 in each bands. they either have no idea what this test is about or manoeuvre to make people ineligible to apply for permanent residency. it is well known practice in australia and noone cannot deny it. Last year, in the midst of the financial crisis, many states in OZ raised their ielts test requierement ( 8 in each bands in some states) following the decision of the minister to reduce the number of migrants. another worthy this to mention is the cost of ielts in Australia: almost twice of any country in the western world.

Recommendation, you are dealing with a criminal government with no ethics. Thieves only interested in getting your money. i suggest you find another country where your skills are valued. good luck with everything -)


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Old 05-27-2010, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilwayne View Post
For many years, i have tried to make sense out of the english requirement for migration purposes. I came to the conclusion that the whole system does not make sense. Under the current system , your skills are less important than your language proficiency given that more points are allocated toward your ielts test score than your university degree. In the end of the day, no matter what your ielts score is, if you don't have the proper skills to become a doctor, then, the system is inefficient. it does not take a genious to figure that out. the emphasis should be on one's skills not on a perceived " language proficiency"

i have taken the ielts test twice socring an overall score of 8 with a minimum score of 6.5 in the writing section. yet, i was awarded 15 points, the same point awarded to people with a score of 5. make sense? The method used to assess one's proficiency in english fail to account the subjectivity of the test. ielts is not a math test. Yet, they persist in maintaining this requierement of 7 in each bands. they either have no idea what this test is about or manoeuvre to make people ineligible to apply for permanent residency. it is well known practice in australia and noone cannot deny it. Last year, in the midst of the financial crisis, many states in OZ raised their ielts test requierement ( 8 in each bands in some states) following the decision of the minister to reduce the number of migrants. another worthy this to mention is the cost of ielts in Australia: almost twice of any country in the western world.

Recommendation, you are dealing with a criminal government with no ethics. Thieves only interested in getting your money. i suggest you find another country where your skills are valued. good luck with everything -)
You make some rather inaccurate claims there for qualification assessments give either 40, 50, or 60 points and there is a mandatory requirement of a minimum of 12 months experience and with more than three years experience in the four years prior to applying, additional points can be attained.
Up to 30 points can be attained by age.
25 points is the maximum possible for english ability.
I think you will find the minimum standard of english is now 5.5 or 6.0 and may even be 6.0 to get 15 points, the level for 25 points being 7.0

The Immigration department are not specialists in occupations assessments nor testing for english competency and that is why the relevant organisations are used, it often being occupational assessment organisations that will contribute to the required IELTS.
What the states do in regard to sponsoring is their business [ and given the rest of your inaccuracies, I would be surprised if they have set a higher standard than Immi are using ] but immigration is not controlled by the states.

As for numbers, you might care to actually have a look @ 1.1.1 Economic migration - Outcome 1.1 - Annual Report 2007–2008
You will find that the numbers for the past two years ending 2009 - 2010 have exceeded what was before and have been relatively stable, a similar number of over 100,000 also budgeted for 2010 - 2011.
The government does not do the IELTS testing nor set charges.

As to your final paragraph, in good Australian English, you are full of it and sprout complete BS, such people not usually talking through their mouth.
Yes, you will do very well staying away from Australia.





Last edited by Wanderer; 05-27-2010 at 05:21 AM.

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Old 05-27-2010, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilwayne View Post
For many years, i have tried to make sense out of the english requirement for migration purposes. I came to the conclusion that the whole system does not make sense. Under the current system , your skills are less important than your language proficiency given that more points are allocated toward your ielts test score than your university degree. In the end of the day, no matter what your ielts score is, if you don't have the proper skills to become a doctor, then, the system is inefficient. it does not take a genious to figure that out. the emphasis should be on one's skills not on a perceived " language proficiency"

i have taken the ielts test twice socring an overall score of 8 with a minimum score of 6.5 in the writing section. yet, i was awarded 15 points, the same point awarded to people with a score of 5. make sense? The method used to assess one's proficiency in english fail to account the subjectivity of the test. ielts is not a math test. Yet, they persist in maintaining this requierement of 7 in each bands. they either have no idea what this test is about or manoeuvre to make people ineligible to apply for permanent residency. it is well known practice in australia and noone cannot deny it. Last year, in the midst of the financial crisis, many states in OZ raised their ielts test requierement ( 8 in each bands in some states) following the decision of the minister to reduce the number of migrants. another worthy this to mention is the cost of ielts in Australia: almost twice of any country in the western world.

Recommendation, you are dealing with a criminal government with no ethics. Thieves only interested in getting your money. i suggest you find another country where your skills are valued. good luck with everything -)
I dont understand why is there a need for you to complain. If you do not think it make sense, that is your point of view.

Australia is a western country and migration policy and rules are entirely up to their discretion. I am a migrant myself and sometimes I do not understand how migrants can turn up here without proper language skills.

I do not think you have much need to complain, just be thankful for the country allowing you to stay. If you made that choice, if you think it is not reasonable, dont come, that is your choice.


Last edited by Wanderer; 05-29-2010 at 11:15 AM. Reason: Lets keep personal attacks out of it.

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Old 06-01-2010, 04:17 AM
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I have been a teacher in Asian countries for the past 5 years. Many people, in the country in which I live, consider English to be their first language. Despite that fact the standard of speaking and comprehension could not be considered on a level with a native English speaker, even amongst local teachers of English language. The government have recognised this as an issue and are addressing the problem.

Where English is not the first language, and where translation is used as a method, manipulation of the semantics can occur. Not every single word has a definite equivalent in another language. There could be a tendency to impose the mother tongue systems into the target language. The extent of this influence can vary, depending on the similarity of the languages, and the proficiency of the user.

From your narrative above, I suspect that English is perhaps not your first language. I may be wrong, and it may just be your hightened emotional state that is giving rise to your inappropriate use of language, punctuation and spelling.

I do not believe that there is a racial bias in the requirement for the English language proficiency test. Indeed for some professions the test is required regardless of the ethnicity of the migrant.

Perhaps Aqeel is correct in saying that all migrants should be required to take the IELTS. With the introduction of the new legislation, who knows you may just get your wish. But be careful what you wish for, you may just get it.

The above not withstanding, I do wish you luck in your endeavour to become a permanent resident of Australia.


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Old 06-01-2010, 11:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coach View Post
I have been a teacher in Asian countries for the past 5 years. Many people, in the country in which I live, consider English to be their first language. Despite that fact the standard of speaking and comprehension could not be considered on a level with a native English speaker, even amongst local teachers of English language. The government have recognised this as an issue and are addressing the problem.

Where English is not the first language, and where translation is used as a method, manipulation of the semantics can occur. Not every single word has a definite equivalent in another language. There could be a tendency to impose the mother tongue systems into the target language. The extent of this influence can vary, depending on the similarity of the languages, and the proficiency of the user.

From your narrative above, I suspect that English is perhaps not your first language. I may be wrong, and it may just be your hightened emotional state that is giving rise to your inappropriate use of language, punctuation and spelling.

I do not believe that there is a racial bias in the requirement for the English language proficiency test. Indeed for some professions the test is required regardless of the ethnicity of the migrant.

Perhaps Aqeel is correct in saying that all migrants should be required to take the IELTS. With the introduction of the new legislation, who knows you may just get your wish. But be careful what you wish for, you may just get it.

The above not withstanding, I do wish you luck in your endeavour to become a permanent resident of Australia.
It is true what you say about local language and other languages influence on English Coach for though never having taught english as such, I did help out in another country and whereas the population had been exposed to European languages prior to English, even with teachers going to school to qualify to teach english, they were not constructing sentences with use of adjectives or adverbs.

Over a couple of weeks I helped a couple of teachers in that area, basically having them do considerable rewriting of essay sentences and their new found english English was so quickly apparent to their own lecturer, they were back with a request from their teacher to meet me as she herself had studied in Australia.
I also found some locally produced dictionaries leaving something to be desired.

Despite having helped a couple of teachers on to the right track, one later immigrating to Australia, it could well be that one teacher alone would go back to other ways just by weight of peer teaching and so yes, english is not always english.

A good level of english is certainly more important to some professions than others as is recognition within professions in Australia that a closer attention to all communication means is required at times depending on who is being communicated with.

As to the regulations, all immigrants do need to get an IELTS assessment if more than the standard 15 points for english ability is to be attained and that even goes for applicants who have had english as their native tongue from birth and have attained University level qualifications all in english.

I think it was different in the past as english native tongue applicants did get 25 points as a standard approach but that changed quite a few years back.

I would be surprised if it was changed much in the raft of current changes being introduced for they are more about occupations to be listed and priorities.





Last edited by Wanderer; 06-02-2010 at 03:47 AM.

  #18 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2010, 02:10 AM
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I am American, english is my native tongue, and I had to take the IELTS. I think it's perfectly reasonable, and it should be equal for everyone.


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Old 06-02-2010, 06:34 AM
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Coach,

A doctor who has been working in the countryside for many years was asked to sit the ielts test to renew his license. He was required to obtain a score of 7 in each component of the test and unfortunately for him, he failed. By the way, this a region in need of doctors.

Another case: a british nurse with 20 year experience was also required to sit the ielts test. ( you can find the specific details of what i mentioned on google )

I have to disagree with you. i believe there is a deliberate intent to limit the number of migrants for a specific occupation and sadly this is achieved via the ielts test.


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Old 06-02-2010, 12:17 PM
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I have to disagree with you. i believe there is a deliberate intent to limit the number of migrants for a specific occupation and sadly this is achieved via the ielts test.
Why is it sad? Is it because they are limiting migrants? Certainly they must do this to some extent. Is it because they are doing it via ielts? Well, if you must limit, language seems like a good way to do it. It is definitely more objective than nationality, age, race, etc.

Most competent people should be able to pass the ielts. Others can do it the second time. If they can't, well sorry but if you have to limit migrants, cut the weakest.


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