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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2014, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Donkey View Post

So if my partner decides to leave me after more than five years together, my permanent visa should be withdrawn? Five years in a country is a long time of working and paying taxes and making it your own home. But maybe that wasn't what you meant?
Well obviously 2 years is not long enough with people staying with them until they get their permanent residence. Immigration definitely to have to do something about it. The question is what do they do?

I recently heard of someone having a baby just so they can get a visa to Australia ... a new low level of a baby being used


  #22 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2014, 11:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mish View Post
Well obviously 2 years is not long enough with people staying with them until they get their permanent residence. Immigration definitely to have to do something about it. The question is what do they do?

I recently heard of someone having a baby just so they can get a visa to Australia ... a new low level of a baby being used
I wasn't aware of this being a big issue and I haven't seen any statistics or anything of people leaving their spouses just because they got their Permanent residency approved. Personally I think it would be quite hard to fake all the evidence that is needed as the process is today. But at the end of the day many relationships do break down, whether it is because the relationship was not genuine to begin with or other reasons how would you know? I think we have to have a system that benefits the people that are trying to do the right thing, and I believe that that is the majority of us

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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 12:23 AM
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I know at 5 people who have used the partner stream to obtain PR fraudulently..and aren't ashamed to admit it. I sadly also know 1 person who said his entire relationship was for a visa who's wife had a baby girl a month ago. The abuse of this stream is RAMPANT because it's the shortest and easiest way to residence if you have no skills...I don't even believe language competency is part of the criteria for this visa either. I have said before on this forum that I'd support an increase to 5 year wait for PR to help weed out the not legitimate applications. However corporations would have to loosen their restrictions on workers - it's come up a few times that well paid,high responsibility jobs require applicants to have PR....which would cause problems for a lot of applicants if this change was made.

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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 01:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Donkey View Post
I wasn't aware of this being a big issue and I haven't seen any statistics or anything of people leaving their spouses just because they got their Permanent residency approved. Personally I think it would be quite hard to fake all the evidence that is needed as the process is today. But at the end of the day many relationships do break down, whether it is because the relationship was not genuine to begin with or other reasons how would you know? I think we have to have a system that benefits the people that are trying to do the right thing, and I believe that that is the majority of us
It is hard to fake all the evidences but as we have seen on this forum it's easy for some people to fake the relationship.

I'm not sure if 5 years would stop scammers though when this is the only option for them to migrate.
I think it would make the situation even worse for sponsors being used for 5 years instead of 2 (especially when we are talking about old men marrying young girls).
It would also destroy lives of so many people who have been settled in Australia and probably have kids here but now have to leave the country because their relationships didn't work for some reason.

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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 01:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Mish View Post
Maybe to get faster processing times and take into account people that use people to get a visa to oz you could suggest that they do a review of the permanent resident visa after 5 years . I did think that would be a great idea, the people get permanent residence which helps with jobs but at the same time they see they need to be in the relationship for about 8 years or more ... a win, win situation
That's a terrible idea. Collecting everything together was stressful enough, but having to do it AGAIN after 5 years... blah. We should just assume that couples on PR showed enough evidence and love that they should be on it.

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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 02:00 AM
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I uprooted my entire life to come to Australia. I'm gradually making friends here, hopefully will soon have a well-paying job in my field (though as another poster mention, that is HARD to come by when you aren't PR), and my husband and I are very much in love and both of us are the kind of people who would try everything before throwing in the towel if something happened (we'd go to counseling, etc.). I believe marriage is forever, and I fully intend to spend the rest of my life with this man.

But over 50% of marriages end in divorce these days. So if (God forbid) the worst happened and my husband and I split up after being married for four and a half years, you'd separate me from the friends I've surrounded myself with, the job I love and worked hard to get, and send me home, Mish? Really? Even though I came here under completely legitimate circumstances? There's absolutely no other visa I would qualify for. While I'm in a field where very few Aussies even can do what I do, it's a new enough field that it hasn't made the SOL or the CSOL yet.

Quite honestly, I find that pretty brutal. After five years, you haven't just begun to setup a life here - you're fully entrenched. I think sending people home who have done everything right and become productive members of society is just cruel.

Changing the PR benchmark to five years may weed out a few of those scammers not willing to stick it out for five years, but you'd end up sending home far more legitimate people than scammers, and you'd make life harder for those couples still together because of how much harder it would be to get a job for five years instead of two. And you can't control corporations in a way that forces them to hire people without PR - it doesn't make good business sense for them to do that regularly.

Also, you can get citizenship after four years - so a PR benchmark at five years would be especially mean as it would delay citizenship for all partner visa folks by two years! (You couldn't apply until you'd been PR for a year, so... you'd have to be here six years).

If the government feels comfortable making people *citizens* of this country at four years, making people wait five years for just PR on a partner visa seems excessive.

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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 02:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Valentine1981 View Post
I know at 5 people who have used the partner stream to obtain PR fraudulently..and aren't ashamed to admit it. I sadly also know 1 person who said his entire relationship was for a visa who's wife had a baby girl a month ago. The abuse of this stream is RAMPANT because it's the shortest and easiest way to residence if you have no skills...I don't even believe language competency is part of the criteria for this visa either. I have said before on this forum that I'd support an increase to 5 year wait for PR to help weed out the not legitimate applications. However corporations would have to loosen their restrictions on workers - it's come up a few times that well paid,high responsibility jobs require applicants to have PR....which would cause problems for a lot of applicants if this change was made.
Well that is your personal experience and it doesn't necessarily reflect the reality, I would be very vary to say that there's a large abuse because of that. And no there is no language criteria to fill for a partner sponsored visa. As a citizen of any country I would like to have the freedom to spend my life with a partner even though they don't speak the language of the country where we decide to settle. I think we should show more compassion and understanding to the whole process.

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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 02:16 AM
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Quite honestly, I find that pretty brutal. After five years, you haven't just begun to setup a life here - you're fully entrenched. I think sending people home who have done everything right and become productive members of society is just cruel.
Agreed! People need to actually start their lives (or continue on with their lives) without having the constant worry that they won't satisfy their next visas needs.

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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 05:00 AM
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I don't think changing the 2-year review to 5 years is going to fix it, and as CG said, it could mean having to leave after being here 6+ years (or more if they've applied from a couple of WHVs or other visas).

To better weed out the scammers, I think they'd need to make much more rigid criteria. It would need to be absolutely mandatory that you've lived together for 12 months for a de facto visa. So if you've managed to paste together 12 months through 4 or 5 visitor visas, too bad. If you've lived together for 6 months but were lucky to live in NSW so you could register your relationship, too bad. No more joint gym memberships or receipts that you bought a sofa together to prove your relationship, it would need to be 12 months of joint bank accounts and credit cards or you don't pass the line.

The unfortunate truth is that there will always be ways for scammers to work the system to their advantage. There should be stiffer penalties and better monitoring to quickly deal with fraudulent claims and dobbed in cheaters.

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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2014, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by maggie-may24 View Post
I don't think changing the 2-year review to 5 years is going to fix it, and as CG said, it could mean having to leave after being here 6+ years (or more if they've applied from a couple of WHVs or other visas).

To better weed out the scammers, I think they'd need to make much more rigid criteria. It would need to be absolutely mandatory that you've lived together for 12 months for a de facto visa. So if you've managed to paste together 12 months through 4 or 5 visitor visas, too bad. If you've lived together for 6 months but were lucky to live in NSW so you could register your relationship, too bad. No more joint gym memberships or receipts that you bought a sofa together to prove your relationship, it would need to be 12 months of joint bank accounts and credit cards or you don't pass the line.

The unfortunate truth is that there will always be ways for scammers to work the system to their advantage. There should be stiffer penalties and better monitoring to quickly deal with fraudulent claims and dobbed in cheaters.

I wish someone would have told me and my partner a few months ago that all we had to do was to join the same gym and buy a sofa together in order to qualify for a partner visa. That would have saved so much time and effort

Maggie-May24, ampk, Dinkum and 1 others like this.


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